Game Politics ([info]gamepolitics) wrote,
@ 2005-08-24 23:26:00
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Ad Review Council Yanks Samurai Western Trailer

The Ad Review Council (ARC), a sub-unit of the ESRB, has directed Atlus U.S.A. to withdraw a video trailer for its action RPG Samurai Western. On August 19th a representative of Atlus, U.S.A. contacted media outlets by e-mail with the following message:

"Dear Member of the Media,

If you have posted the Samurai Western (PlayStation 2) trailer on your website we please ask that you remove it from your respective websites immediately as it does not adhere to the ARC's Principles and Guidelines."

Apparently the extra-violent trailer, which included lots of spraying blood in addition to multiple beheadings, ran afoul of ARC standards, which say, in part, "No advertisement should contain any content that is likely to cause serious or widespread offense to the average consumer."

A follow-up with the Atlus rep confirmed that the ESRB contacted Atlus and that the company was "trying to comply with their request to either age-gate or remove the trailer completely..." Samurai Western was released for the PS2 on June 7th* to mediocre reviews.

For its part, the ESRB, as usual, would not comment on the specifics of its enforcement actions. The ARC, however, does impose strict marketing and advertising guidelines by which publishers are legally required to abide.

EDITOR'S NOTE: It's great to see the system work. It would be even better if the ESRB would lift the veil of secrecy.

* Coincidentally, June 7th is the same date that the PC version of GTA: San Andreas was released containing the now-infamous Hot Coffee scenes.


(24 comments) - (Post a new comment)

Sigh.
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 04:48 am UTC (link)
Too bad that this won't attract the attention it should to what is no doubt an underselling game.

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Re: Sigh.
[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-25 09:49 am UTC (link)
Yes. Definitely not a top seller.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 06:19 am UTC (link)
Looks fair enough to me. ARC did a good job.

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Agreed...
[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-25 09:52 am UTC (link)
Yep.

They did what they are supposed to...

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Sage!
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 06:54 am UTC (link)
Multiple Beheadings + Bad Graphics = Bad. WTF were the developers thinking? T_T

On a side note, I'm still shell shocked over the previous thread with Jack.

Dennis, if I was a cat, then curiosity would have taken all my nine lives already. Please comment on whether you might interview Jack. Because otherwise I'll do it myself @_@

(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: Sage!
[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-25 09:55 am UTC (link)
Right now I am planning to speak with Jack on Friday, hurricane permitting.

That Lou Dobbs thread *was* an amazing thing. I kind of posted that as a throw-away and look at all the interest it generated. One of the highest comment counts ever for a single article here at GP.

While JT can be maddening, I do enjoy that he interacts with the gamers here. Perhaps some level of understanding will develop of boh sides.

BTW, just to be clear. I've got no problem with Samurai Western's level of violence. It is what it is... Just reporting on the ESRB/ARC action.

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Re: Sage!
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 10:31 am UTC (link)
>>>Right now I am planning to speak with Jack on Friday, hurricane permitting.>>>

I Look forward to the interview Dennis. Maybe you can also invite Jack to the forums for a quick GP reader Q&A session.

>>>That Lou Dobbs thread *was* an amazing thing. I kind of posted that as a throw-away and look at all the interest it generated. One of the highest comment counts ever for a single article here at GP.>>>

I agree very amazing - learned a few things about Jack myself and I hate to say it but in a few of his post he sounded somewhat normal. Then he went and spoiled it all by saying that we are all talibanist..... oh well you can't expect miracles I suppose.

-Godofyouall


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(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 09:04 am UTC (link)
Why does it take them so long to get pissed off about things like these? The game was already more than two months old by the time the ARC got all anal about it. It's not like the spraying blood is realistic anyway. Blood doesn't do that.

Either way, I liked the game. I've always been a fan of the Way of the Samurai series. Partially BECAUSE of the violence and partially because the games are like interactive samurai movies. I love it.

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[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-25 09:51 am UTC (link)
Yeah, it looked kind of cool, although GameSpot slammed it with a 5.3 review.

I believe that there must have been a complaint to ESRB/ARC about the trailer, which led to the directive to Atlus to remove it.

Absent the pressure of Hillary Clinton, however, the ESRB doesn't talk about investigative actions.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 01:19 pm UTC (link)
>> Absent the pressure of Hillary Clinton, however, the ESRB doesn't talk about investigative actions.

Good for them. They shouldn't.

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[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-26 02:06 am UTC (link)
Disagree... since they have a public trust function.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 02:58 am UTC (link)
Of course you disagree. You've been beating your senseless "accountability" drum forever.

You've never managed to come up with a rational reason for why you want it, but I've come to accept that like Jack, you've your own interests to further. So be it.

But in the real world, organizations don't offer up details into every "investigation" that is spawned by a "complaint". It opens the organization, and it's backers, up to exploitation by those with an agenda (like you and Jack) and serves NO USEFULL PURPOSE. Take a look at how the FCC is being exploited by the PTC and try to rationionally argue that the ESRB to the same pathetic manipulation.

The ESRB DOESN'T have a "public trust" function... They rate videogames according to industry set standards, and despite the bleatings of yourself and Jacko, no one has caught 'em out yet.

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[info]gamepolitics
2005-08-26 12:39 pm UTC (link)
>>>You've been beating your senseless "accountability" drum forever.

Yes, the industry should be accountable.

>>>You've never managed to come up with a rational reason for why you want it, but I've come to accept that like Jack, you've your own interests to further. So be it.

Then we disagree on what a rational reason is.

>>>But in the real world, organizations don't offer up details into every "investigation" that is spawned by a "complaint". It opens the organization, and it's backers, up to exploitation by those with an agenda (like you and Jack) and serves NO USEFULL PURPOSE. Take a look at how the FCC is being exploited by the PTC and try to rationionally argue that the ESRB to the same pathetic manipulation.

I'm not saying they need to reveal every detail. But when they take an enforcement action they should make that known, so "the people" can know about it, and not have to find out through some back door method as happened with Samurai Western or more likely not know at all.

>>>The ESRB DOESN'T have a "public trust" function... They rate videogames according to industry set standards, and despite the bleatings of yourself and Jacko, no one has caught 'em out yet.

They absolutely DO have a public trust function, and I don't believe the ESRB would dispute that. Ratings themselves are a trust issue between the industry and the public. What's more, the ESRBwas established to stave off government oversight.

And remember this... we all love games. It's still okay to criticize the video game industry. Doesn't make one a commie or a culture cop.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 01:08 pm UTC (link)
>> Yes, the industry should be accountable.

You need to demonstrate that there is a problem. You haven't done that.

>> But when they take an enforcement action they should make that known, so "the people" can know about it, and not have to find out through some back door method as happened with Samurai Western or more likely not know at all.

No, they should NOT make it known. First off, it's none of our business. It serves no useful purpose. In cases like the HC non-scandal, it calls attention to material that most people would never have been aware of, ensuring that more people will experience the porny goodness.

>> They absolutely DO have a public trust function, and I don't believe the ESRB would dispute that. Ratings themselves are a trust issue between the industry and the public. What's more, the ESRBwas established to stave off government oversight.

Their "public trust" function (If there is one) is in rating games and no one has been able to show that there is a problem there whatsoever. This function would not be enhanced by opening their operation to outside interference. All it would do would be to open them to unfounded criticism by activists like you and Jacko.

>> And remember this... we all love games. It's still okay to criticize the video game industry. Doesn't make one a commie or a culture cop.

I never said you were either one. You are quite simply WAY off base on this one. It would not help the public or the industry to do what you suggest. When you're right, I'll cheerfully back ya up.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 03:04 pm UTC (link)
(This is a different anonymous respondent.)
Do you think their criteria for assigning ratings and content descriptors should be kept secret? That such secrecy would serve the public interest (i.e., informing parents) because transparency would open them up to unfounded criticism? What about founded criticism?

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 03:22 pm UTC (link)
Their criteria for assigning ratings isn't kept secret. It's very clearly spelled out. (Far more clearly than the criteria for TV or movie ratings.)

What Dennis is asking for (details regarding internal investigations and enforcement actions) is something completely different. It has no bearing on the primary function of the ESRB. It would not make the rating system more effective. It would not serve the public interest, nor would it serve the interest of the industry. It would only serve as a distration from what the ESRB's main function is: To assign ratings.

The fact that nobody has yet come up with an example of a game that was incorrectly rated based on the ESRB's stated criteria speaks volumes regarding the strength of the system.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 04:38 pm UTC (link)
I disagree. The ESRB website does not contain written criteria for assigning ratings and content descriptors. In addition, news articles about the ESRB have reported that the ESRB does not have such written criteria. Perhaps you and I have different interpretations of what criteria should look like. That's fine.

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(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 05:39 pm UTC (link)
If you don't find the information on the ESRB site sufficient, I would be curious to know what you think they SHOULD look like. Because it's quite clear IMO.

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Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 02:02 pm UTC (link)
Patricia Vance

President

Entertainment Software Rating Board

317 Madison Avenue, 22nd Floor
New York, NY 10017 Fax: 212-759-2223



Re: The Warriors to be Released by Take-Two/Rockstar October 12, 2005



Dear Ms. Vance:



As you know, the ESRB’s Ad Review Council (ARC), in accordance with its rules, has just required game developer Atlus U.S.A. to yank the ad trailer for its new game Samurai Western from the public domain because of the gore contained in the trailer. Your own ESRB/ARC guideline is this: "No advertisement should contain any content that is likely to cause serious or widespread offense to the average consumer." You can read all about it at www.gamepolitics.com.



Well, the ESRB needs to be consistent, Ms. Vance. Currently, Take-Two Interactive Software, Inc., is running incredibly violent trailers for its October 12-release game The Warriors that are clearly violative of the above-note ESRB/ARC rule. I have sent you the trailers. The trailers reflect a game that eclipses the violence level even of Take-Two/Rockstar’s Grand Theft Auto games.



Why the discrepancy, the double standard, Ms. Vance, when it comes to Take-Two Interactive? Well, well, well. It turns out that Take-Two, of course, is a “Member” of your sister organization, the Entertainment Software Association whose President, Doug Lowenstein, throws money at politicians who get out of line on the video game issue. The money he throws at them comes from ESA “Members.” The “Members,” which include Sony and Microsoft, pay ESA and Doug Lowenstein to throw their weight and their money around. It is a scheme as old as the payment of a bag of silver to Judas Iscariot, only the ones being betrayed here are children. Jesus said, by the way: “If any of you should cause one of these little ones to stumble, then it would be better for you that a millstone be tied around your neck and that you be cast into the sea.”



Atlus U.S.A. is not a “Member” of the ESA and thus does not have “the juice” that Take-Two has, despite Take-Two/Rockstar’s having been, in the last several weeks, nailed by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission for $8.75 million for “fraudulent accounting practices” and by Senator Clinton, by the US House of Representatives, and by others, including the undersigned, for illegally placing sex scenes in GTA: SA and then lying about it.



Exactly what, Ms. Vance, does Take-Two’s CEO Paul Eibler, who is #43 in Bernie Golberg’s 100 People Who Are Screwing Up America, have to do for the ESRB, finally, to do its job? Does he have to personally walk into a fifth-grade classroom and hand out copies of The Warriors to children, or does pushing Bully and The Warriors to children through corporate surrogates and pimps suffice?



Do your job, Ms. Vance. Tell Take-Two to pull down its public domain trailers for The Warriors. They violate your ESRB/ARC rules.



Oh, and the trailers prove the game has to be rated “AO,” not “M.” Be careful, Ms. Vance. I and others are monitoring you at a point in time that the ESRB is hanging onto its existence by a frayed controller wire.



Regards, Jack Thompson





Copy: New York Attorney General Spitzer

US Senator Charles Schumer

US Senators Hillary Clinton, Joe Lieberman, Sam Brownback, Rick Santorum

Congressman Upton

Assemblyman Leland Yee

Many Others


(Reply to this) (Thread)
Re: Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 02:23 pm UTC (link)
>> Oh, and the trailers prove the game has to be rated “AO,” not “M.” Be careful, Ms. Vance. I and others are monitoring you at a point in time that the ESRB is hanging onto its existence by a frayed controller wire.

Uh huh... Jack has finally lost his already tenuous grip on reality.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-25 10:09 pm UTC (link)
See Jack, last night was cool, but then you gotta go and pull **** like this and just spoil the illusion.

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 10:39 am UTC (link)
ah, man.. dude, chill out. I saw the trailers, it's just a bunch of people beating the crap out of some other people..

(Reply to this) (Parent)
Re: Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 02:19 pm UTC (link)
The problem here has nothing to do with games or violence or any of that. It has to do with the ignorance of our country. We have a problem with assumption. Our mixed culture has created such a high-strung, ultra-conservative outlook on life in the U.S..

Where in the "rule books" does it say that things like video games and animation are only for kids?? That's the problem. Some people, like Jack just can't comprehend that many cartoons and most games nowadays are for adults, not kids. I see movie trailers everyday on tv with tons of violence, and that's ok. But put it in a cartoon or a video game, and it becomes offensive? Does that sound crazy to anyone else? The Japanese are probably having a field day with this one.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)
Re: Jack Thompson Warns Pat Vance
(Anonymous)
2005-08-26 05:32 pm UTC (link)
Well, the Japanese are the ones who censor hentai... *roll eyes*

They are by far not a perfect society :P

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