Game Politics ([info]gamepolitics) wrote,
@ 2006-02-14 12:25:00
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Entry tags:david walsh, gta, nimf, prostitutes, sex workers, swop, violence

Sex Workers Protest Grand Theft Auto

Opposition to the Grand Theft Auto series makes strange bedfellows...

...like the Sex Workers Outreach Project (SWOP) and Dr. David Walsh of the National Institute on Media & Family (NIMF).

SWOP has a statement concerning GTA on its website, which reads, in part:

"...in the interest of furthering sex workers' human and civil rights to life and personal safety, we object to any media which represents sex workers as legitimate targets of violence, rape and murder. Censorship is a blight on the freedoms we hold dear but we wholeheartedly encourage citizens to vote with their dollars by refusing to purchase products which encourage the denigration and destruction of prostitutes. Since the video game Grand Theft Auto accrues points to players for the depiction of the rape and murder of prostitutes, SWOP-USA calls on all parents and all gamers to boycott Grand Theft Auto."

The SWOP statement cites a 2001 NIMF research report which, among other conclusions, says, "...(there is) a strong correlation between exposure to violent video games and various forms of antisocial behavior."

GP: If anyone has a right to be heard on this issue, it is the hookers themselves. Real-life prostitutes are often regarded as non-persons and have been frequently targeted by freaks and even serial killers.

Big thanks to GP reader Nature Leseul for alerting us to this story.




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Well..
[info]anticron
2006-02-14 06:06 pm UTC (link)
..I don't see the point?

As an ordinary guy, I have to note that the stuffing gets beaten out of any old "ordinary guy" in games as well. It doesn't any more justify real life violence than watching Tom & Jerry advocates animal abuse.

As always, "common sense" applies. Games aren't real.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Well..
[info]dudelovenext
2006-02-14 06:50 pm UTC (link)
As always, "common sense" applies. Games aren't real.

I don't think a lot of people know about this "common sense". Lots of these groups just don't get that these are JUST GAMES!

Like all these other groups, they're merely picking on video games cause it's the thing to do nowadays. What about movies that show violence against hookers? Any mention of that (maybe there is, I'm not gonna check the website from work)?

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: Well.. - [info]wedgetalon, 2006-02-14 07:45 pm UTC

(Reply from suspended user)
Re: Well.. - [info]expert_gamer, 2006-02-16 12:37 am UTC
Re: Well.. - [info]hooahwahwah, 2006-02-16 12:38 am UTC
Re: Well.. - [info]burntouttech, 2006-02-16 02:58 am UTC
Re: Well.. - [info]wedgetalon, 2006-02-16 07:27 pm UTC
Kinda torn here...
[info]sprngpilot
2006-02-14 06:07 pm UTC (link)
I respect what they have to say about this. They have good points about the dangers of media which "represents sex workers as legitimate targets of violence, rape and murder." However, there is no rape in the game, and players don't "accrue points" for killing hookers. As I'm sure everyone here already knows, killing random people in the game makes it *harder*, not easier - be it prostitutes or some generic person on the street. It feels like someone (I'm guessing the NIMF) is feeding them misinformation and propaganda against GTA in hopes of gaining a more sympathetic ally in the public eye.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Kinda torn here...
[info]sir_bissel
2006-02-14 07:47 pm UTC (link)
There's the pimping part of the game where you beat up the people that are beating your hookers...

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(Reply from suspended user)
Re: Kinda torn here... - [info]sprngpilot, 2006-02-16 12:04 am UTC
Re: Kinda torn here... - [info]expert_gamer, 2006-02-16 01:05 am UTC
Re: Kinda torn here... - [info]burntouttech, 2006-02-16 03:01 am UTC
Re: Kinda torn here... - [info]tsuroki, 2006-02-16 03:40 am UTC
Re: Kinda torn here... - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-16 02:52 pm UTC
More singling out...
[info]bustermanzero
2006-02-14 06:09 pm UTC (link)
First of, wasn't that study by the NIMF considered flawed by other experts who had nothing to do with the game industry all together? I mean, the NIMF is opinionated, and so are we. And lets not forget that the term 'antisocial' has been open to debate on when it applies for quite some time now (even in movies like 'One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest').

Now then, I love how they don't mention that you get 'points' for killing a lot of people, not just prostitutes. Grannies, construction workers, business people, hoods, etc. And since when does two people both consenting to sex, even if it is solicited, considered rape? This reminds of Law and Order: SVU...

And should point out that there is a morale lesson for those who like to go on rampages in GTA games: in the end, you always end up dead or in jail (unless you've got a LOT of money). They allow you do do some crazy stuff that you'd think twice about in real life, but you do pay for it.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: More singling out...
[info]bustermanzero
2006-02-14 06:10 pm UTC (link)
Oh yeah, my 'point' line was refering to the fact that you actually just nab cash from the dead person's wallet.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: More singling out... - [info]barfo, 2006-02-14 06:28 pm UTC

[info]silver_derstin
2006-02-14 06:09 pm UTC (link)
Prostitute: I'm getting beat up because of Grand Theft Auto!

Rational Gamer: Uh... Your pimp has been beating you ever since you started on the streets at 14 to pay for you drugs.

You can complain all you want, video games mimic real life better then some hope...

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]exaggeration17a
2006-02-14 06:30 pm UTC (link)
Some sex workers operate legally in the state of Nevada, you know. And SWOP is trying to get prostitution decriminalized to get pimps, drugs and STDs out of "the oldest profession in the world". They're not claiming GTA is responsible for all violence against prostitutes, they're just uncomfortable with a game that re-enacts the violence that they have to deal with on a regular basis. Like Dennis said himself, if anyone deserves to be heard on this, it's the prostitutes.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 06:43 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]persephoneflame, 2006-02-14 07:12 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]exaggeration17a, 2006-02-14 07:36 pm UTC

(Deleted post)
Re: WTF???
[info]coffeejedi
2006-02-14 06:16 pm UTC (link)
i'm just going to call you a bad speller


it's "whore" btw

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: WTF??? - [info]agentch, 2006-02-14 06:31 pm UTC
Re: WTF??? - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 06:52 pm UTC
Actually, - [info]riffraff1138, 2006-02-14 06:55 pm UTC
Re: WTF??? - [info]bigman_k, 2006-02-14 07:03 pm UTC
Re: WTF??? - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 07:11 pm UTC
Re: WTF??? - [info]bigman_k, 2006-02-14 07:20 pm UTC
Re: WTF??? - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 09:15 pm UTC
Correct me if I'm wrong...
[info]the_new_l
2006-02-14 06:18 pm UTC (link)
But isn't whoring yourself out illegal in like, 99.9% of the country? When you engage in an illegal "trade", you DO make yourself a target for rape and violence and whatnot, because you're already trying to shy away from the cops.

I'm waiting for Jack Thompson to show up, defending the prostitutes and pretending to be Jesus. "Let those among you who have never sinned cast the first flaming post! HOOAH!"

-TheNewL

(Reply to this)


[info]barfo
2006-02-14 06:20 pm UTC (link)
Now i don't think that Rockstar lives in some high moral castle on the issue of how they are implementing prostitutes in their games, but the idea that GTA is somehow singling them out as "legitimate targets of violence, rape, and murder" is extremely misleading. Theres nothing different between how the game treats you implementing violence or murder (theres no system for rape anyways) on a random sex worker as opposed to a random person (wanted level increase, sometimes they drop cash), and to my recollection (not 100%) there are no main story missions (or even optional ones) where you specifically have to target sex workers. If they want to come out and say that they oppose any games where people are hurt, or any games that contain any depictions of sex workers at all, then those would at least be consistent and truthful opinions, but trying to make it out like the design of the game is targetting them is disingenious, and frankly it seems like they are self-exploiting in order to advance an unrelated cause (anti game rhetoric).

Plus, annoyingly, we see here the repetition of ignorant beliefs like the game somehow encourages "rape", or the half-truth that GTA series allows players accrue meaningful "points".

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]riffraff1138
2006-02-14 06:45 pm UTC (link)
to my recollection (not 100%) there are no main story missions (or even optional ones) where you specifically have to target sex workers.

There's actually a few missions in which the whole point is to help prostitutes. Look at Luigi's missions in GTA III, and Jizzy B's missions and the Pimping sub-missions in San Andreas.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]expert_gamer, 2006-02-16 01:40 am UTC

[info]soliloquy76
2006-02-14 06:25 pm UTC (link)
I treat my GTA ho's with respect.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]dudelovenext
2006-02-14 06:51 pm UTC (link)
Word.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]dolorosa, 2006-02-14 07:02 pm UTC
Forget those ho's - [info]timed95, 2006-02-14 09:46 pm UTC
Re: Forget those ho's - [info]hilaryduffgta, 2006-02-14 10:11 pm UTC
I'm on their side
[info]moriarty70
2006-02-14 06:27 pm UTC (link)
I understand what they are saying, they've be lowered to second class citizen's for ages, with states like Nevada legalizing it, it only makes sense that they deserve better quality of life standards.

I know first hand how people can view it, when I first saw my buddies playing GTA 3 they were laughing thier asses off at being able to have sex then pummle the hooker to a pulp with a bat to get their money back with a few extra dollars.. Needless to say I was disturbed at the time, more at their reaction than the action itself.

So I guess what I'm saying is, they have a very good point that this may very well continue to lower their status in the coming generation.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: I'm on their side
[info]acroamatis
2006-02-14 06:55 pm UTC (link)
Again, I don't know that it's singling out prostitutes. They just happened to implement the prostitution payment system because it's "Vice City". I'm sure if there were a merchant system (say, you could go into a 7-11 and buy a beer or something), you could then kill the proprietor and rob him. It's basically the "I get something and don't have to pay for it" mentality - amplified, of course, because of the taboo around sex to begin with.

(I still don't agree with that level of violence in video games, I just think the groups have the wrong idea when opposing it.)

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: I'm on their side - [info]moriarty70, 2006-02-14 07:09 pm UTC
Re: I'm on their side - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 07:18 pm UTC
Re: I'm on their side - [info]moriarty70, 2006-02-14 07:40 pm UTC
Re: I'm on their side - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 09:16 pm UTC
More support for Jack Thompson
[info]revotruthinary
2006-02-14 06:27 pm UTC (link)
Well it looks like Jack Thompson's fight is gaining new support. Who knew that street walkers and Jack Thompson would make such great bedfellows?!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: More support for Jack Thompson
[info]skemodan
2006-02-14 06:42 pm UTC (link)
HAHA bedfellows. GET IT?!

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: More support for Jack Thompson - [info]rhanlav, 2006-02-14 11:07 pm UTC
Re: More support for Jack Thompson - [info]poet_ninja, 2006-02-15 12:12 am UTC
Re: More support for Jack Thompson - [info]goodrobotus, 2006-02-15 01:04 am UTC
Re: More support for Jack Thompson - [info]beardoggx, 2006-02-15 02:53 am UTC

[info]wxdiva
2006-02-14 06:27 pm UTC (link)
They're asking people to support an illegal activity? Next thing you know, the Drug Dealer's Outreach Project will release a press statement criticizing the negative portrayal of pushers on TV and in movies.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

N.B.
[info]acroamatis
2006-02-14 06:56 pm UTC (link)
It isn't illegal everywhere.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: N.B. - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 06:59 pm UTC
Re: N.B. - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 07:06 pm UTC
Re: N.B. - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 07:10 pm UTC
Re: N.B. - [info]exaggeration17a, 2006-02-14 07:19 pm UTC
Re: N.B. - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 08:40 pm UTC
Re: Correct me if I'm wrong... - [info]persephoneflame, 2006-02-14 07:15 pm UTC
Yeah, but... - [info]the_new_l, 2006-02-14 09:43 pm UTC
Amazing....
[info]goodrobotus
2006-02-14 06:29 pm UTC (link)
Do they think that the sort of people that think of them as nothing more than objects would think any differently about them if GTA wasn't released? Of course not! Regardless of my own personal feelings on the actions available in GTA (Remembering I'm someone who simply 'could' not be 'Bad' in Fable or Black and White 2) It looks far more like a reaction to misinformation.

These women have the right to be protected. As much from deliberate misinformation as from knife wielding phsychopaths who probably are the inspiration for GTA, rather than vice-versa. Art amd Media mimicks life, not the opposite.

(Reply to this)

There is no rape, there is no (true) point system...
[info]tsknf
2006-02-14 06:36 pm UTC (link)
There is killing, but only if the player wants to, you're not made to.

As for the NIMF quote, "correlation does not prove causation"....

(Reply to this)

Curiouser and curiouser...
[info]getwellgamer
2006-02-14 06:39 pm UTC (link)
Honestly, every time I think I've seen the strangest thing on Gamepolitics, something comes along and tops it.

"Encourages the denigration and destruction of prostitutes"? Let's think about this here:

You go up on the sidewalk in a Grand Theft Auto game and accidentally (or intentionally, not my place to tell you how to play) run over a prostitute. If there's a cop around, you'll get one star. If there isn't, nothing really happens- after all, nobody saw it.

Now take that same scenario and replace it with "Old Lady", "Power Executive", or "Construction Worker." What's different? Nothing! Singling out a model archetype in a game like this is silly. You don't see the Construction Worker's Union complaining, or the AARP, or any other groups that might be wildly extrapolated from a crude archetype in a videogame.

This is silly complaining for the sake of complaining, replete with Jack-style fact-checking. GTA games don't have "points" and never is there any scenario that even allows rape, let alone encourages it.

--Ryan Sharpe
President, The Get-Well Gamers Foundation

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Curiouser and curiouser...
[info]phantompvp
2006-02-14 08:09 pm UTC (link)
Now take that same scenario and replace it with "Old Lady", "Power Executive", or "Construction Worker." What's different? Nothing! Singling out a model archetype in a game like this is silly. You don't see the Construction Worker's Union complaining, or the AARP, or any other groups that might be wildly extrapolated from a crude archetype in a videogame.

There's some difference. There's no option to have sex with a construction worker for money, then kill said construction worker to get your money back. I recall something like that in GTA3.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]barfo, 2006-02-14 09:35 pm UTC
Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]inabottle, 2006-02-14 10:33 pm UTC
Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]getwellgamer, 2006-02-14 11:47 pm UTC
Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]nleseul, 2006-02-15 12:21 am UTC
Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]getwellgamer, 2006-02-15 12:31 am UTC
Re: Curiouser and curiouser... - [info]nleseul, 2006-02-15 01:01 am UTC
This should provide some entertainment....
[info]duncan_922
2006-02-14 06:39 pm UTC (link)
Well!!! Although when Whacky Jacky stops by this one, hilarity will ensue, I feel I must do this:

I thought I'd get the heads up on you Jack Thompson. You'll come here and say that our precious Take-Two/Games are going down. You'll come in and say that games are detrimental to the "world's oldest profession and it's workers, and for that they should be banned. You'll come in and say that the SWOP has already asked your advice for a class action lawsuit agains TT/Rockstar and you will defend them on court because you are an expert in the subject becase you appeared on CBS for 2 minutes talking about the subject of violence in video games. And you'll come in and say that we gamers must get a life, we are loosers, brain-damaged, etc. Then you'll make a few of your stupid "press releases" in the form of a letter again mentioning how you are an expert on the subject because you were twice on CBS last year on the subject and you'll threaten the prostitutes to to do your bidding, or else! (This I'd like to see) You'll also manage to throw the words "murder simulators" and "pixelante" around there somewhere. You will blame all the evils of this world on Blank Rome, Paul Eiber, David Walsh, Howard Stern, Janet Reno, Penny Arcade, MySpace.com, 2 Live Crew, Dennis McCauley, video games, video game players and people who post about video games, ad nauseam! And you'll throw in a few Hooah for good measure!

Did I cover it all???? Yes??? Good!!! Now let the entertainment begin!

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: This should provide some entertainment....
[info]acroamatis
2006-02-14 07:00 pm UTC (link)
Please.. this shouldn't be necessary. First, Jack hasn't posted yet, and as such, why bring up his name? Second, I find myself wincing every time I see your screenname followed by a dense block of text. Clearly, you're capable of writing - why not comment on the issue, rather than issuing what is clearly a challenge to Mr. Thompson?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: This should provide some entertainment.... - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 07:02 pm UTC
Re: This should provide some entertainment.... - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 08:43 pm UTC
Re: This should provide some entertainment.... - [info]duncan_922, 2006-02-14 07:25 pm UTC
Re: This should provide some entertainment.... - [info]hilaryduffgta, 2006-02-14 10:14 pm UTC
I admit it...
[info]chronozaga
2006-02-14 06:55 pm UTC (link)
Okay, I admit it, I've played "How many prosties can you kill before the cops kill you" while playing GTA.

You know what else, I own an AR15 (Semi-auto M-16, like the US army uses), a 12 gauge pistol grip shotgun, a Glock 17 9mm (like the "gangstas" in the movies use), and a Walther PPK (The original James Bond gun), and I've never shot a living soul. Heck, I've never shot a living thing besides this annoying bird that kept pecking his way into my attic, and that was with a pellet gun.

I am one of the vast majority of gamers who can separate reality from fantasy, and still enjoy both.

"...we wholeheartedly encourage citizens to vote with their dollars..."

We have, that's why GTA is a critically acclaimed best selling franchise.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: I admit it...
[info]silver_derstin
2006-02-14 06:57 pm UTC (link)
"We have, that's why GTA is a critically acclaimed best selling franchise."

I haven't voted with my dollars for GTA, but it's not because it promotes evil acts against prostitutes, but because I don't like the game in itself. Incredible, isn't it?

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: I admit it... - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 07:02 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]howdoyouplead, 2006-02-14 07:33 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]chronozaga, 2006-02-14 07:46 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]dysfunctionmnky, 2006-02-14 07:34 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]chronozaga, 2006-02-14 07:42 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]dysfunctionmnky, 2006-02-14 07:47 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]chronozaga, 2006-02-14 07:57 pm UTC
Re: I admit it... - [info]dysfunctionmnky, 2006-02-14 10:32 pm UTC
Wow - [info]enmitywithin, 2006-02-14 07:56 pm UTC
Re: Wow - [info]chronozaga, 2006-02-14 08:01 pm UTC
Re: Wow - [info]chronozaga, 2006-02-14 08:04 pm UTC
Re: Wow - [info]dysfunctionmnky, 2006-02-14 10:37 pm UTC

[info]apathyislife
2006-02-14 06:56 pm UTC (link)
You know I'm surprise we don't see a lot of these kinds of statements from entire countries, especially when it comes to war games.

I mean... you'd think that vietnam would be condemning every single vietcong game to come out.

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]silver_derstin
2006-02-14 06:58 pm UTC (link)
This just in: Neo-nazi groups want to sue Call of Duty and Battlefield 1942 for not promoting the nazi ideals the way they want them to.

I can see the day...

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

(no subject) - [info]apathyislife, 2006-02-14 07:01 pm UTC
A bit unfair.. - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 07:03 pm UTC
Re: A bit unfair.. - [info]apathyislife, 2006-02-14 07:05 pm UTC
whoops - [info]apathyislife, 2006-02-14 07:08 pm UTC
Re: A bit unfair.. - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 07:07 pm UTC
(no subject) - [info]silver_derstin, 2006-02-14 07:03 pm UTC
They should call JT...
[info]gpplascencia
2006-02-14 07:17 pm UTC (link)
Hey Jack! Here's your chance to rally followers to the cause!

(Reply to this)


[info]durlock
2006-02-14 07:23 pm UTC (link)
So, let me get this straight. (I've only skimmed the commentary, so if I bring up something already done, I apologize)

They're getting mad at a fantasy because 'gamers' treat a 'ho' in said 'fantasy' like an object?

Don't most people do that IRL anyway? And, prostitution is legal in the sense of escorts and massage parlors. They're just named different and you call them up and booking an appointment instead of picking them from the street.

Also, this has been going on since for a long time. I'd like to toss a name into this entire stupid spiel. Jack the Ripper, I'm sure everyone has at least heard of him. Don't see how videogames made his mind snap.

Seriously, the researchers today are nubcakes. I've been antisocial all my life and it's not due to videogames, it's due to fucktards and idiots who're jocks and think they're the might prime shit and hurt anyone else that doesn't conform to their lifestyle. Pretty sure, back then, they didn't play videogames. No, they played sports games which is a bigger cause for violence then anything a controller hooked up to a console can do.

Unless you're playing with a wireless controller these days. Word of advice, if you live in an apartment above the first floor, don't through the controller towards the patio. Stupid Puzzle games. >_

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]durlock
2006-02-14 07:25 pm UTC (link)
Pardon my lack of proper spelling and grammar too. I just woke up not that long ago. >_>

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]crashmog
2006-02-14 07:25 pm UTC (link)
Once again, NIMF just makes things up as they go along.

Firstly, no points system in GTA:III/VC/SA. It's cash. Prostitutes function like any other pedestrian: if you kill them, they will sometimes drop money. Sometimes they don't. Rewards for killing a prostitute are no different from the rewards for killing any other Non-Player Character (aside from law enforcement officials). Yes, I know, money vs. points isn't important in the grand scheme of things, but it's just more proof that they don't know what they're talking about, or care to find out.

Secondly, and more importantly, there is no rape.

Let me reemphasize that.

There. Is. No. Rape.

They are prostitutes. You pull up beside one, she gets in the car (except in SA, where she just leans in the window and you accept or deny her business. She gets into the car and your money steadily drains away. Park someplace secluded, and there's sex. You just hear suggestive noises and watch the car rock, but it's obviously sex. Nothing about the noises is rape-like: they always sound like they're generally enjoying themselves.

When your health is replenished (with a small bonus to your health points), she gets out of the car and saunters off. That's right, saunters. She doesn't throw herself out of the car and start crying. She just goes on about her business.

San Andreas had the most progressive system of all: you actually pick a girlfriend, take her out on dates, and she'll sleep with you if you take good care of her. CJ doesn't say "hey, bitch, let's go." The woman invites him in. And again, the game makes every indication that she is definitely enjoying herself when they have sex.

NIMF is just another extreme right-wing group that clumsily tries to mask their agenda with shoddy, questionable research. They've been calling on boycotts of games without getting their facts straight for years. And, unsurprisingly, they completely ignore any feedback (even very gentle, constructive feedback) that calls their statements into question. =p

(Reply to this) (Thread)


[info]howdoyouplead
2006-02-14 07:38 pm UTC (link)
Yep, that about sums it up.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

(no subject) - [info]ithmarvin, 2006-02-14 08:12 pm UTC
There actually *is* rape... - [info]duumvirate, 2006-02-15 01:16 am UTC
Re: There actually *is* rape... - [info]crashmog, 2006-02-15 01:21 am UTC
So whats next?
[info]awol1010
2006-02-14 07:36 pm UTC (link)
Gang members and drug dealers complain about GTA making them targets as well? Taking it even further will PETA complain about Mario jumping on turtles? Oh the UN complaining about Battlefield 2 about people targeting medics first.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: So whats next?
[info]dysfunctionmnky
2006-02-14 07:45 pm UTC (link)
I don't think that their concern is too far fetched. It's legitimate in the sense that people do play "How many hookers can I kill before I die." But then again if you look at mainstream media. Sex Workers are almosts always portrayed as abused drug-users that are so addicted to heroin or meth that they have to stay in that profession. I think that their complaint should be against Hollywood and society rather than GTA.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: So whats next? - [info]enmitywithin, 2006-02-14 08:01 pm UTC
Re: So whats next? - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 09:21 pm UTC
This is absolutely retarded
[info]enmitywithin
2006-02-14 08:00 pm UTC (link)
So lemme get this straight. There is a certain group of women called "prostitutes" usually synonomous with words like "ho" "whore" "slut" that kind. These women offer their bodies for money, thus making themselves objects. They can get STDs, and lord knows what else while being prostitutes.

Also, Prostution is illegal in almost every country, USA especially.

These women have not only formed a group, but also complain about being objectified when that's exactly what they do when they have sex for money?

Someone needs to smack David Walsh. He's back to being stupid again. And I had hopes that he would have become smarter after distancing himself from John.

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: This is absolutely retarded
[info]acroamatis
2006-02-14 09:33 pm UTC (link)
First, read the article. Walsh did not ally himself with the Sex Workers Outreach Project. Their statement makes reference to a NIMF report. So someone needs to smack you for making an uninformed comment... when the information you need is in the article you're commenting on.

Prostitution is not illegal throughout the US, as you'd know (if you didn't already) by reading the comments to this article. Nevada has several areas where prostitution is legalized. Holland legalized it (at least in Amsterdam). Japan has a tacet agreement not to come down hard on legal, well-run brothels. And so forth. So certainly not "USA especially".

Furthermore, you're doing the industry a disservice by presuming that all prostitutes are female - there are male prostitutes as well. While "whore" could be a proper term for a prostitute (though a derogatory one), "ho" is not - it's simply a contraction of the larger word.. and "slut", as in my earlier post is not synonymous with prostitution. In addition, the women do not offer their bodies for money - they offer a service for money, in the same sense as a massage therapist, or a physical labourer - both use their body to make money, the actions are simply different.

Finally, as commented here, legalized prositution seeks to avoid drug abuse and STDs, because they care about the health of their members. Read a bit more before posting next time.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: This is absolutely retarded - [info]enmitywithin, 2006-02-15 12:20 am UTC
Re: This is absolutely retarded - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-15 01:14 am UTC
Waitaminnit...
[info]zero_beat_x
2006-02-14 08:11 pm UTC (link)
Prostitutes are protesting the objectifying of prostitutes in GTA when they are objectifying themselves in real life?

Where's the WTF Police when you need them?

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Waitaminnit...
[info]nleseul
2006-02-15 12:22 am UTC (link)
Even if prostitutes are “objectifying themselves,” there's a difference between being an object of lust and being an object of violence.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: Waitaminnit... - [info]zero_beat_x, 2006-02-15 01:46 am UTC
Low blow.. but someone had to do it...
[info]trencher
2006-02-14 08:14 pm UTC (link)
Come on Jack.. Defend your wifes rights!!..

(Reply to this) (Thread)

Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it...
[info]jdecamp
2006-02-14 08:21 pm UTC (link)
Hey now! Jack is fair game, but leave his family out of it. They don't deserve it.

(Reply to this) (Parent)

Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it... - [info]malakimknight, 2006-02-14 08:21 pm UTC
Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it... - [info]trencher, 2006-02-14 08:24 pm UTC
Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it... - [info]acroamatis, 2006-02-14 09:34 pm UTC
Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it... - [info]beardoggx, 2006-02-15 02:50 am UTC
Re: Low blow.. but someone had to do it... - [info]markusdragon, 2006-02-14 10:24 pm UTC
Tasteless... - [info]getwellgamer, 2006-02-14 11:51 pm UTC
Re: Tasteless... - [info]trencher, 2006-02-15 02:12 am UTC
Lay off the hookers (pun intended)
[info]the1jeffy
2006-02-14 08:20 pm UTC (link)
I admit the rape comment was out of line and stupid. But these groups have an excellent point. I bet many of you here that are poking fun (pun un-intended this time) or ridiculing hookers, have never really met one. So you are going with the stereotype of: hookers = drugged up skanks. I can tell you for a fact, that this is not always the case. Try going to Vegas. There are some truly "classy" (as classy as selling sex can be) prostitution businesses. Now, argue the morality issue all you want, but the simple fact is: sex sells. Whether it's Jessica Simpson's latest skimpy album cover, Playboy, Hustler, Strip Clubs, or Prostitution, you can't argue there is big business there, legal or not. The advocacy group here is just saying one thing: hookers are people too. There's all types of them, too. Just like gamers. You have your drugged up skanks, to be sure. But judging every hooker on them is like judging every gamer on that basement virgin (we all know at least one). Let's not jump to stereotypes here. They have a great point, proven by many of the comments here. People seem to view hookers as just kill fodder, and not a person in a service profession (albeit an un-moral one).

(Reply to this) (Thread)

In a perfect world...
[info]getwellgamer
2006-02-15 12:36 am UTC (link)
I'll admit my on experiences with prostitutes have been the window-girls in Amsterdam, so I might be going a bit apples-and-oranges here, but I honestly have nothing bad to say about the profession from a financial standpoint. As a Christian, I believe sex should be a sacred thing between a husband and wife, but if you're unencumbered by such morals, then ind a need and fill it, I suppose. I would never partake myself, but I certainly agree that they shouldn't be treated like second-class citizens for it.

Sure, in a perfect world, we wouldn't *need* prostitutes, but the same could be said for doctors, firemen, and the police.

(Reply to this) (Parent)(Thread)

Re: In a perfect world... - [info]the1jeffy, 2006-02-15 01:27 pm UTC
Re: Lay off the hookers (pun intended) - [info]nleseul, 2006-02-15 01:13 am UTC
Re: Lay off the hookers (pun intended) - [info]the1jeffy, 2006-02-15 01:34 pm UTC

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